Which one do you prefer to track project tasks?
Trello or Jira?
Other good alternatives -
if (teamSize < 3)
else if (teamSize < 6)
else if (teamSize < 11)
throw new Error ('your team is too big')
So, no tool for larger teams?
But, I think jira is best for larger teams > 50
There needs to be something between 11 to 50 members.
I'm not sure a team that big really works. A company, sure, can have more than 10 people, but I doubt that a group with more than that many employees will be agile. If you are asking for a company-wide tool, I'd say Jira is the best option (even though it is slow and has a bad UX), but I've also worked in some places where each individual team (say, "mobile app developers", "full-stack developers", "data scientists") would choose their own tool according to their needs/size.
Makes sense. For me, Jira is extremely difficult to setup, plus developers don't like Jira..
I settled for Codegiant.io and it's working great with beautiful UI UX
For smaller projects Trello is the best.
Jira is a bit of an overhead when it comes to configuring it and it requires some knowledge or walkthrough to get started. It is a powerful tool though.
Codegiant.io is also worth exploring when you think trello is under-powered. The UI/UX is beautiful.
Unless you are an enterprise that delights in crushing souls on a daily basis, "Jira" is never the correct answer. ☠️
Trello gets the job done splendidly if you aren't concerned about time tracking and other granular things of that nature (some of which can be solved with color labels and card naming conventions).
JIRA is actually fantastic if you get it working right, with all the integrations and things, but it really needs a trained professional to set it up perfectly for your team.
My standard phrase is "JIRA sucks, but there isn't anything better".
That being said, for a small project, it's overkill.
Even i love to use Jira, but I feel it takes time for anyone to get started on using it. Lot of people around me find it very confusing. Lately, I started using Codegiant.io and it seems like a promising alternative to Jira.. Also the documentations are the best that I've come across..
As a developer I really dislike using Kira, it's complex, slow and has awful UX. Trello is good for small teams (I'd say max 5). I haven't used it myself but https://ora.pm looks very promising.
True. Jira has never been developer friendly.
Ora.pm looks promising but it looks similar to Trello.
Recently, I have been impressed with Codegiant.io as it has end-to-end development tools and also has a better UI/UX than Jira.
I have used Trello on past projects and liked it. I am currently using Jira and I don't mind it, but I also don't have to manage it. At home I use Kanboard https://github.com/kanboard/kanboard. For solo projects I really like org-mode (http://sachachua.com/blog/2014/04/org-mode-helps-deal-ever-growing-backlog/). My preferred editor is emacs.
Nice. You have an interesting stack.
Any tool you recommend for API documentations?
This is a bit off topic, but if org-mode with emacs peaked your interest then may I also recommend helm-projectile for navigating large projects:
Someone even made an emacs helm minor mode for dash:
If you are new to emacs you might also want to check out these great videos on using emacs:
Lots of good videos on org-mode there as well.
Choosing an editor that is right for you is important. Don't underestimate how much it will affect your motivation. I spend 10 to 16 hours a day in an editor. That is my world and so I have made it someplace that I like to be. In fact, I am switching my windows manager from fvwm (which I have loved for 16 years now) to emacs windows manager so that I can do everything from emacs:
Tutorial 14 from Uncle Dave's youtube channel will give you an idea of what exwm is like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gk9-q8tXbMs
Dash is an offline API documentation browser for Mac:
Zeal is the equivalent for Windows and Linux:
I know that you were wondering about what tools you should use for API documentation and not what repo you should be contributing to. Here is the guide to contribute to dash and by extension zeal:
Note: the guide doesn't only cover how to contributing to the dash repo. It includes a list of tools to generate api docs for different languages. So it is an excellent resource for answering your question.
You have a really good stack of tools :)
Thanks for sharing.
I use http://clubhouse.io, but I know the team, and am already familiar with it.
Better alternative: Notion.
+1 for this. I love Notion.
I use https://zenkit.com/. It has Kanban features like Trello, as well as multiple other options to view your data. Which makes it great to track any kind of project or task.
I work closely with the developers, so I can pass on any feedback.
I use Ora.pm and it is definitely the best one :)
Jira is overcomplicated (so many PMs I know that work with Jira and they hate it but it's a company policy). There are plenty of softwares available for big teams and big companies. Try out a Kanban software for example. I work with Kanbanize.
I use gitlab tadkboard
free forever plan
2 way binding of git commits and relevant task
very easy to create new tasks
There a place for some ux improvements but the overall is very good.
Shameless plug but I am working on a simple issue tracker that the whole company can use: https://tinytracker.co - would be more than happy to give it to any IH members for free, in exchange for a little feedback :)
Looks nice my friend :)
But, the issue tracker market is really crowded these days.
For small projects I’ve been using GitHub Projects since everything is there anyway. Jira is good when you have a good product manager or scrum master to setup it for your team. Trello is always practical. I’m trying now notion.so and I’m really enjoying it.
You summed it up :)
But, Trello is underpowered and jira is over engineered.. codegiant.io really fits in between them for slightly larger projects that Trello gets difficult with..
Pivotal Tracker is really great.
Wekan is Open Source, you can check it out. https://github.com/wekan/wekan/
It's maintained by guy named Lauri, know as xet7, and main communication channel is on our internal chat on https://chat.vanila.io.
I am using Kanban Flow to manage my own life. It's like Trello except the UI/UX is ugly, there are not third party integrations (but so far I don't use them anyway). On the other side, it lets you estimate your cards in term of points AND you have a built in pomodoro timer coupled with a powerful report generating feature.
I am curious to see how Kanban Flow can help managing life :P
What tasks do you have in your life? And you have different people working on your life tasks?
I have different categories for my tasks. Creative, Chores, Coding, Sports, Social and Experiment.
Creative can be writing into my daily journal, reading 50 pages of Pascal's book or publish a new article
Chores is self explanatory
Coding is a bad name (but I did not find anything better), I recently created a neat landing page for a web agency I am starting, I am stepping up my front end skills with FrontLoops (building UI/UX), I take on freelance, contribute to open sources, etc.
Sport because I am trying to get in shape, mostly revolve around swimming and running
Experiment is anything new, it's generally unbounded, I am currently learning to cook new dishes, yoga, Chinese.
It might seem completely insane to track all aspect of your life, but it helps me see where my time goes. It also help me see what works and what does not, incorporating new habits and rejecting bad ones. Having a routine, prevent me from overspending too.
If you are less then five people, a shared todo.txt under source control is the best project management tool you can ever come up with.
If you are more than five people, you are too big for a startup anyway.
Each line is a task.
Taks are sorted by priority (upper in the file, more important/urgent)
You don’t need to add to much fluff: Promotes brevity.
.txt is a universal format that you can edit anywhere and store offline (including mobile phone and tablets when you install proper apps)
You have an offline-enabled project management app by default.
It’s simple and effective.
Near-zero latency, no scripts to load, no web page to render.
Reminds you all the time that how much you need to be frugal to succeed.
Anyone can prioritize things: Promotes a flat organizatinal structure.
… You can add more to the list.
In one of my first startups, we’ve raised ~$1.3M with a single todo.txt shared by three people and we haven’t altered the approach until we reached ~20 people.
And that was >10 years ago when startups were not being evaluated at the price of a herd of unicorns: So, that $#!% works.
Don’t underestimate the power of simplicity.
Awesome reading this.
Which tool did you use on reaching 20 people?
It has been a long time so my memory may mislead me:
What we did not use was Jira definitely :)
I remember using Microsoft Team Foundation server, and an in-house git, along with an open source task management system, it was “mantis” https://mantisbt.org/ I think.
But “a lot” has changed since the last 10-12 years.
If it was now, after reaching 20 people, I’d choose github enterprise and trello: The combination is simple enough to manage your needs until you reach ~100 people level.
Then trello for two-pizza-eater-sized teams (5-6 peeps) and (inevitable but…) Jira for tracking the velocity and progress them all
so trello for scrum teams with a trello-jira integration, and jira for project manager types who never generally see a single line of code.
Pivotal tracker is my go to for my side projects. We use jira at work, it's such a chore
Check out Teleo (https://www.teleo.co)
It brings chats and tasks together in one place so you can collaborate on projects easily and seamlessly.
Disclaimer: I work for Teleo but also use it!
Looks nice. Nice substitute for Trello but not for Jira.
I use Jira and Confluence at my day job. I also wrote a lot of training docs on how to use it effectively. If your a small team, I would recommend their hosted option. If you are a decent sized company, you might want to consider self hosting.
These two systems together offer some very powerful features. You can setup custom workflows and automate status reports. You can even do GTD with JIRA.
If you take the approach of constraining the set of features you use, these two systems can really help you in the long haul.
I like Jira too. But my developers complain that it is not developer friendly. one of them asked me to try some modern tools like codegiant.io or scrumpy.io that seemingly have a better interface
I think the issue with Jira is there is a lack of training and process. If you have both established, its a very powerful tool. I regularly work with a non-technical department staffed mostly with attorneys. There number one question is always: what is the difference between Confluence and Jira
But, isn't Jira an overhead to work with non-technical department.
In our case, we use trello for non-technical staff and they love it.
I use https://backlog.com/.
Although im biased towards anything Nulab make (ps. great Japanese startup!)
If you're a full-on software team on a complex product you probably need Jira and somebody acting as a part-time project manager to keep it up-to-date.
If you're small, I'd suggest trying Airtable instead of Trello. It's equally capable as a Kanban board but you can link across tables and created powerful different views.
Notion is great. Surprised Asana wasn't mentioned yet.
If only any of these awesome new JIRA alternatives had proper on-premise hosting available.
we used jira in my last job, for a year or so. It was a poor match for our situation: small team, chaotic startup. It was slow, difficult to customize (and nobody wanted to use it to report bugs, too intimidating for non-technicals).
As soon I was promoted, I changed it for the smallest, simplest kanban tool I could find.
So, it depends on team size, and how many processes do you have to follow. For smaller teams, in young startups, I recommend avoiding Jira
Yes, even I have been evaluating for a team of 25 members and Jira seems a big overhead for this team size.
Looking to switch to something slightly easier than Jira but more powerful than Trello. Considering Codegiant.io and it seems good so far.
About 25 members.
With that big of a team I don't think Trello makes sense. My vote is Jira or something like that.
I have been happy with Codegiant.io considering a better UI/UX and more features minus the jira level complexity.
I use trello but thats because I'm "loosely" following the process from the drift team.
http://go.drift.com/hubfs/Burndown -- A Better Way To Build Products.pdf
But, trello is under-powered I feel and Jira is over-powered. There needs to be something in between.
Have you also considered Asana?
It might be worth trying. Adding it to that thread.
I've only used it as an individual, but Notion.so is absolutely fantastic. I'll sing it's praises all day long.
I haven't used it in a team (Although it seems to have good support for that). Its a great resource for internal notes, wikis & general administration.
For 'tracking tasks' I'd probably use Trello, but for anything more complex (i.e. tables, paragraphs, images) I'd use Notion.
Trello. I also plan to use trello for public roadmap so that that the users can choose what features they want next. Jira is maybe better for larger teams IMHO.
Can I see your public roadmap?
After I complete and launch the product itself then I will post in IH. Been delaying since last two months but hopefully will ship towards the end of May.
I would love to see as well :)