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72 Comments

Why you won't find a tech cofounder

Lots of people are looking for a Technical Co-founder, but I'd venture to say that a lot of you in this situation have the wrong approach.

See, I'm an experienced software engineer. I've worked with some well-known clients and enjoy building things from scratch. I've also responded to quite a few of the posts that advertise seeking a "Cofounder" in this corner of Indie Hackers.

The problem is that many of you aren't actually looking for a partner, you're looking for an unpaid employee! As a techie, I can say that part of the enjoyment of building things for fun is indulging in a bit of creativity in the way I can solve problems and overcome challenges. If you were to approach me and tell me that I have to solve the problem with a specific tech stack or by using a specific language, you've not only cornered yourself into that particular tech, but you've also solved a problem as a self-proclaimed non-technical founder when you shouldn't have.

Let's start with the literal word "cofounder." The word itself implies that you are founding something with a joint effort. If you're a Senior-level marketing professional, I'm not going to tell you to advertise the product exclusively on Facebook or to forget about SEO because that's not my field of expertise.

If you are truly trying to be a cofounder and get others excited about joining you, you can't take on these types of challenges until you have a technical cofounder in place. This role is your partner and someone for you to collaborate with, not someone you're going to give orders to. Techies would rather keep working their full-time job than join you in your plans of dictatorship.

I just felt the need to share this.

  1. 17

    same here, most people have no plan at all or the plan is to build and APP and then see what happens. And they are looking for someone that "believes in the idea", no financial plan, no market research (beyond "the market is .... million/billion worldwide" ), no specification and no clear path to market.
    And the stupidest idea of them all "need like minded people", "cultural/team fit", you do not have money and/or product but you already have 3 cofounders and none of them is a software developer, the type of programmers you can find that fit in this arrangement are the opposite of what you need.
    But there is always a chance to get lucky :)

    1. 2

      That's what it's like working for some startups as well. If your culture doesn't value transparency and open communication, I'm out. What would be some of your ideals?

      1. 1

        This comment was deleted 2 years ago.

  2. 15

    Perfectly said!
    Been a dev for almost 18+ years, and agree with every word.

  3. 7

    I'm dev also. This is 2 way road. It's not easy to find non-tech founder for exact reasons. We devs want/need marketer to do marketing or salesman to do sales. This is just one of the reasons, there are many others

  4. 5

    As a person who does growth and a bit of coding - I think this is pretty one sided. Generally speaking, people who come and say: Would be cool to build this app (without being in the industry, understanding context and customers, prospective buyers, having an existing network already) - should be avoided in the first place as its a red flag.

    In fact you can find this red flag within technical people too who just spend 1 year to build out a deep learning transformer on kubernetes connected to blockchain just to realize nobody cares.

    So here is the gist - it depends...

    • Are you committed to work the same amount of hours (full-time / part-time)
    • Are you in the same situation / context and aligned on future (VC / bootstrapped / side project income)
    • Do you have prospective customers / network?
    • Is there a sustainable channel to bring in more clients?

    Basically, there is a difference between "idea guy" and "non-technical operator"

    1. 2

      I definitely agree. I'm by no means saying all non-tech founders are bad, I've met a few that definitely did their part and brought a lot to the table. This whole topic makes me want to build something that helps address this problem, but I'm not quite sure how you would solve it. Something like an eHarmony for founders? Lol I don't know.

      1. 2

        I think YCombinator has a matching system now, but it doesn't really work that well. I thought if someone would pull it off, it would be them. In fact some pre-seed programmes actually charge equity for helping finding cofounders. OnDeck is also partially made for that. But then again - its always going to be a problem.

        Here is an example from Atlassian founders for instance:

        Everybody I knew was so unexcited to go get a job because we had completed eighteen months of work experience at these big, boring companies. Everyone was quite the opposite: vibrant, intelligent, and motivated. So I sent an email to about two or three people saying, “How about we do something crazy and don't go and get a job at one of these companies? Instead, we’ll start our own company.”

        Scott was the only person that replied and he said, “Sure, let's try that.”

        The email didn't say anything about what we were going to do. It just said, “Let's start a company instead of going to work for the man.” Scott replied, we formed Atlassian, and the rest is history.

        1. 1

          Interesting...Cool story about Atlassian! Thanks for your feedback!

  5. 3

    This is so true. I have been in many meetings over the years with someone with an idea promising he is very good at marketing and sales but he just needs someone to build the product. If everything goes as plan he might even give me a bonus but being co-founder is out of the question because he has spent so much time thinking of this idea that he thinks is very unique.
    This always feels that this person with the idea sees himself as i-am-very-clever and now I am just going to find some random nerd to do the work.

    1. 4

      Ideas aren't worth much...Execution is where it counts! A bad idea with great execution can win more customers than a good idea with poor execution.

  6. 3

    Very much agree. I made a similar comment :

    "One other point, in the title it mentions "co-founder/programmer". This indicates you're looking for someone to build the product. If you're technical and want to have it the programming effort shared, awesome! If you can't code and looking for the "co-founder" to do the programming, you need to bring something big to the table like funding, connections, etc. Otherwise you'll unlikely find a recent introduction willing to be your coder because they rather build their own idea."

    1. 1

      absolutely correct, if you asking the tech person to spend at least few months working for free you need to come up with same value yourself , but most people are "I can sell it / find funding but need to show something" but no prof you can do it.
      One of the main reasons I decided to work on what I want instead of someone else's idea, if nothing else I can have fun building it.

  7. 2

    I could not agree more, I get so many of these type request. I left my full time job to be free, not work for free

  8. 2

    I agree. I am a non-technical founder looking for a technical co-founder and from what I have seen most non-technical founders are looking for an unpaid employee.

    In my case, I wanted to go as far as I could while still searching for a technical co-founder: I now have an MVP, a website, a pitch deck, a product demo, a business model, 2 advisors, a financial plan, and I'm in an incubator (but the startup is not incorporated yet).

    This is an unconventional approach, but it makes the search for a technical cofounder more of a personal choice for the technical cofounder (because it de-risks a little bit of the situation).

    1. 2

      You've taken some really good first steps! You haven't overstepped your expertise and you've made significant progress on things that you know how to do. I think you're set up well to find a tech cofounder!

    2. 1

      I think this is the best approach someone that is non-technical can take. It helps derisk while also showcasing that you're trying to solve a real problem. More often than not, you're solving a problem that you experience for yourself and there is problem/founder fit. If you're trying to build something big you need the entire team, fundraising, sales, marketing, technology. The team needs to align on the larger mission/vision.

  9. 2

    The best people I've worked with approach devs with problems and get their expertise on how it should be solved, not come with a feature shopping list.

    The problem is that many of you aren't actually looking for a partner, you're looking for an unpaid employee

    So true, and you can tell this is the case when the conversation feels or sounds exactly like an interview for a dev job when they spend more time talking about your skillset and try to size up your experience.

    1. 1

      I mean it's kind of a weird thing to do though right? You want to make sure the person looking to partner with you is an expert, but you don't want to be their boss. What kind of questions would you ask if you were evaluating a co-founder?

      1. 1

        I would just ask questions about past projects/endevours/ventures.

        You can get a quick feel for someone's ability from the things they've built or sold in the past, i.e if they're like "yeah I launched this community and made 100k revenue" or "i built this side project that got 100k downloads".

        1. 1

          Not everyone has found success yet though, so how do you avoid losing out on someone like that?

  10. 2

    Hey 👋, as a software engineer, I can totally relate to your words.

    Do you seek a cofounder as a techie? If yes, for what traits are you looking? Or what kind of relationship do you see is ideal between a techie and some stranger from the internet?

    1. 2

      I'm not really actively seeking a cofounder, but I'm very open to working on projects with others that are open to suggestions, willing to accept constructive criticism, and not of the mindset of making all the decisions. It has to be a partnership or it won't work. What are your thoughts on the matter?

      1. 1

        A partnership mindset is vital.

        If I sought a cofounder, for me, the formula of 1 + 1 = 2 would be good enough, but if I could partner in a way to make 1 + 1 = 3, it would be perfect.

        It does not matter if the cofounder is a techie. The question is if we together can make a synergy.

        1. 2

          I love your perspective!

  11. 1

    This is total FACTS.

    Also, being technical doesn't mean you are a dummie in business, UX, design, or virtually anything else. Often times technical people are creative as well as strategic thinkers who can and WANT to think about multiple problem areas.

  12. 1

    Yeah, finding a cofounder (technical or not) is you basically asking someone to embark on a journey of unknown challenges and creative problem solving with you. It will have to be an equal partnership. Otherwise you’re just looking for a contractor… and contractors generally don’t come for free.

  13. 1

    Hey @KyleL, how can I reach out to you?

    1. 1

      Sorry for the late reply, but why do you want to reach me?

  14. 1

    As always great advice Kyle! It's always great to meld talents in the early stages to get a startup off the ground.

  15. 1

    Probably not always the case, but:
    As a tech founder, the more you are trying to de-risk a potential engagement by looking for a project with a solid validation (product demo, business model, financial "plan", GTM strategy, etc), the more likely you are to come across people looking for unpaid employees.

  16. 1

    This is what Steve Blank said in his 2014 blog on writing code as a founder. "A founding web/mobile team without a coder past the initial stages of Customer Discovery is not a startup"

    https://steveblank.com/2014/09/03/should-founders-know-how-to-code/

    1. 2

      I completely agree with this article especially the part about "Coding is the DNA of a Web/Mobile Startup". Thanks for sharing!

  17. 1

    Agreed, bubble.io claims you don't need a tech co-founder but it's not quite true. There is no alternative to a tech co-founder if you're building something serious

  18. 1

    you just need to find you kind of cofounder (and maybe even friendship)
    also it is a very disgusting thing as "orders" in edgy 21st century when everyone has a therapist

  19. 1

    Completely agree. There are so many times I have had the same thoughts, but never vented it out.

    Either implement it, or provide technical help to the developers that are hired/outsourced to, that's also something I have heard.

    As a techie, our brains demands to bring analytical curiosity to other fields is something which many just cannot understand.

  20. 1

    I've been there, pretty much the same situations.

  21. 1

    Indeed, almost every non-technical founder does this wrong. This is why I recommend not taking equity just because. I've seen scenarios on Twitter where the "cofounders" will get a "huge" 5% share for contributing 60% to the success of the business and lose 40% of their pay.

    And the long term they end up quitting simply because they're not getting the return on their investment, in terms of time. It's a win-win for the non-tech founder since they now have a working business and they can easily find another "cofounder", now even cheaper for 1% equity, and no pay at all.

    My advice to technical cofounders is to understand your worth, and no "Idea" is not everything, it's nothing without you!

    1. 1

      Great feedback! Do you think it's fair for cofounders to ask for 50% or more of equity upfront before any work has been performed? How much equity, if any, is an idea alone worth?

      1. 1

        Depends on the idea as well. If the idea is "just another ____" e.g. existing & proven market ideas, marketplaces, etc. In this case give idea 0% value, plain zero. Otherwise depends on the uniqueness of it, and whether the startup relies heavily on technical work over marketing/sales work or not.

        If the initial founder has great leads and has proven sales/marketing records, then he'll get more than 50%. Never go for 50-50 split. That never works.

        It doesn't sound fair for someone to come up and ask for a hefty share in "your" business. But settle these things mainly based on factors of each individual's contribution. e.g.

        1. Time given to the venture (full-time/part-time)
        2. Any money invested/paying salaries.
        3. Has proven records from earlier, or has audience ready for sales/marketing/MVP.
        4. Experience doesn't matter as much, but Present skills do. Whatever skill you offer, how much does it weigh in the stack of the company.

        So basically start from equal grounds 50-50, and then start weighing these factors, you'll never stay at 50-50 if you do it right.

        Most importantly, get it down on a paper, make it legit, not just words on a call. Learn more about vesting etc. Take a call. Good luck!

        Worst case scenario - You'll learn for the next time.

        1. 1

          whatever the idea is, it is worth 0 without execution, even if your idea was the google search engine before google existed.
          Every idea need technical and non technical execution.
          I have build complete working products in 3 months but they did not go anywhere because the sales people where unable to sell despite existing market and financial backing.
          I also have systems that took 3 weeks for simple product (not unique idea that many people have done before) that made millions (for the customer) in the first year just because everything was reedy before the development even started and the application had big user base and generated revenue from the day 1

          Best ideas are the ones that have customers ready to pay before the product exist, everything else is equal parts luck and a lot of hard work.
          the question is "do you feel lucky" when a sells person tells you "I can sell it"

  22. 1

    Ideas are worth less than nothing until they are actually validated in the market. If a non-technical founder is looking for a technical cofounder, they need to be willing to split that pie wide open. You as the technical cofounder will most likely, at some point, feel like you are doing the majority of the work and yes, you will most likely not get paid during that initial period. If you agree to those terms, make sure the agreements are put in place and the expectations and understandings are clear. Everyone has their role to play, so make sure the house is in order before you even start. If it's not right to start with, it's only going to get worse in the long run.

    1. 1

      Lol I tried to say it loudly and proudly!

  23. 1

    Going on my 8th year of professional development. You hit the nail perfectly on the head. It's so frustrating to see these attempts constantly.

    1. 1

      Thanks for your feedback. Is there a way we could help non-technical founders better understand this problem?

  24. 1

    Good to know. my technical cofounder bailed on me the week before I had meetings set up with angels. YIKES.

    Anyone looking to advance backend software dev to make it easier for companies to ship product.. hit me up!

    1. 2

      I'm interested in knowing how you found your initial cofounder and what contributions were made by both parties. Would you mind sharing?

      1. 1

        I worked with him to build and scale tech @ Delivery Dudes -- a restaurant delivery service. We got acq'd and wanted to start something in the dev tools/saas space. I'm a UX designer, turned PM, turned newb FE engineer. He's a pure back end engineer.

        I set the vision, business model, conducted user interviews, created wireframes, prototypes etc. I'm writing the marketing site and front end product in nextJS/tailwind. Also responsible for fundraising, meeting with VC's and owning the capital path, and hiring. Have a few folks in mind for when I get my seed funding but want a cofounder.

        He was responsible for the backend support.

        Ultimately he got a cushy day job and doesn't want to do a startup.

        1. 1

          Dang dude! I hate that you had that experience, but it sounds like your cofounder wasn't as truly committed to the project as you were. Where are things at now? Are you still looking to partner with someone?

          1. 1

            I split my week with coding and user interviews. Met with 15 back end engineers and several PM’s and designers last week.

            I have a few strategic angels lined up but I don’t want to roll out SAFES until I have a cofounder.

  25. 1

    Good point. I believe that probably the simplest approach is to offer to collaborate on a project for a month or two without immediately referring to ourselves as cofounders, directors, or Olympic gods.

    Declare the project's purpose and meaning clearly, look for common ground (if there isn't any, break up right away), and just try. And, of course, it should be stated at the start that if the process is to everyone's liking and will be effective, the second phase - the partnership discussion - will follow.

    1. 1

      I like this approach.

  26. 1

    From the reverse, if you as a tech founder trust yourself to be able to learn new skills and aren't worried about doing marketing/sales/etc perfectly the first time, the only consideration is the time factor. For side projects it's less urgent. Then you're left with, why do I need a non-technical founder at all?

    1. 2

      I definitely see your point, but even with the willingness to learn it's more challenging as a solo founder especially if you're looking to raise money. What challenges do you face personally on some of the projects you've taken on?

      1. 1

        I'm not in the raising money camp but good point. My main challenge right now is just time to build. That'd be present with or without a cofounder.

  27. 1

    I wasn't aware that this is a pattern. Might this be a particular pain point by itself? Perhaps it's worth validating.

    1. 1

      It's a pain point for me for sure. As an entrepreneur, how would you solve this?

      1. 1

        Validate by finding additional technical founders with the same pain and verify It's something a solution to is worth paying for. If validated start by creating a database of tech & non-tech founders. perform a sane background check on both parties and then allow for a "speed dating" session where founders can pair up. If you see traction attempt to automate parts of the process and build a dedicated platform for founder pairing.

        1. 1

          Sounds like a worthwhile venture! How would this succeed where other platforms haven't?

          1. 1

            The differentiator should be in the focus on the persona of a technical founder who experiences this pain as well as the quality of the background checks and matching. Possibly also the willingness to relatively do more leg work and allow a more personal experience than others to guarantee customer satisfaction can give an edge.

            1. 1

              So would it be of value to create a Members-only cofounders platform that offered this for a monthly fee? Maybe the free platforms are just too open and unmoderated? What do you think would be entailed in the "background check"?Just exploring the idea more. Good stuff!

              1. 1

                I think it can be of value. Open and unmoderated platforms tend to have a low SNR. Take for example upwork vs niche marketplaces which include an interview process for both parties (gig/job seekers & posters). A background check should at least consist of an interview process based on a questionnaire which tackles the original pain points as well as a professional validation of experience for the tech founder as well as the business/non-tech founder. A possible additional source of value is to verify whether the business idea is validated in the first places and allowing the parties to perform better risk management in case it isn't or the validation is weak.

  28. 1

    This also includes letting the co-founder contribute to brand and design decisions as well. Co-founding sounds like a type of marriage where you simply need to be fair to each other and do what makes sense. I'm a solo founder so I might be talking out of my ass :P

    1. 1

      Very true! I feel like I default to doing things solo bc of the lack of quality people looking to partner up. Maybe I set the bar too high?

      1. 1

        There's a lot of quality people out there, I think it's hard to find people who share the same passion for the subject matter and can make time to work on it

        1. 1

          sharing a passion for the subject matter is only relevant when there is no money and the project takes more than 2-3 months to keep developers motivated.
          In all other cases a good developer is a good developer and liking or not the subject matter is irrelevant, good developers like solving problems by coding logic it matters less is the product going to sell chocolate, concert tickets or play cat videos.
          Working on global and/or important problems is a bonus not reason to do software development.

        2. 1

          I completely agree. I constantly find myself in situations where I'm driven to be the best in the field, but I'm surrounded by those that have accepted mediocrity. Maybe that's what jobs do to people... they don't push you to be your best.

  29. 7

    This comment was deleted a year ago.

    1. 1

      Yes! Exactly this! How do we, as technical professionals, help the non-technical break this pattern?

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