Plan, do, learn: My somewhat hardcore work routine

A fantastic post would be an example of an actual day following this.

Agreed.

I didn't want to go into too much detail here because a) people might not be interested for all I know, and b) each of the PDL loops are so different and involve so much nuance that they deserve their own posts.

asd

What do you do for the "learn" part of the cycle? Is it a reflection of what went well and how you could improve? Or something different?

What I do in the learn stage varies a lot depending on which level of PDL loop we're discussing. As I mentioned in a reply to @GetThereFaster, now that I know some people are interested in the nuances, I'll probably write standalone posts discussing the different levels of PDL loops — especially days, sessions, and cycles.

But a quick and incomplete answer is this:

I score my performance (0–10) against my goals, and then I write my thoughts on what went right or wrong, and why. At the low, actionable levels of PDL loop — sessions (90-minute work phases) and cycles (5- to 30-minute work phases) — these performance assessments look a lot like interstitial journaling.

In practice, this means that "working," for me, is essentially a process of error-correcting my way forward. If I'm ever distracted, or annoyed, or tired, or wired, I quickly identify and address it rather than allowing it to weigh down my progress.

Additionally, it's very easy for me to see patterns emerge — both good and bad. Which allows me to take action that I wouldn't otherwise consider. Sometimes action means "stop working and go for a long walk outside — you're clearly mentally fatigued."

cc @ryanthemaker

Same here. Really curious to hear how you handle the reflection part.

Given you also have ADHD, don't you also struggle with getting easily distracted during those concentrated sessions? For instance, if I'm reading a book in one of those sessions, my brain will start bursting out ideas and I'll find myself dropping the book and walking around the house.

I've got two answers to this question. The first, which is kind of a meta answer, is that I do have ADHD but not toward the debilitating end of the spectrum. In fact I hesitated to even mention my ADHD in the original post, but I have far too much business training to pass up a compelling copywriting hook. ;)

The second answer is this: Do I get easily distracted during concentrated sessions? Yes. Emphatically yes. At least… by default. Therefore, fuck the default. I implement a powerful suite of techniques, apps, procedures, and mental training exercises to combat distraction.

Most of these tactics for traction (the opposite of distraction) take place in the session and cycle PDL loops — and not only have I been innovating on and refining them for many years, but I'll keep refining them indefinitely, since the system, by its very nature, is a learning cycle. (I've even built my own personal applications to address certain problems that aren't tackled by the market — one of which I literally use every single day as a critical component of my PDL loops.)

So as I've said elsewhere in these comments, I'll have to do standalone deep-dive articles on days, sessions, and cycles to share some of the goods. I'll also do write-ups on some of the supplemental tools and mental models that support and contextualize these routines.

Do you think strictly following these routines is too disciplined? i.e., that over time we become addicted to progress (somehow we get mental) and we forget to have fun and end up being productivity freaks?

I love, love, love this question and cannot wait to publish some of the full-length articles it will take to address it.

But the short answer is no. I suppose there's such a thing as "progress addiction" but for an action to be classified as an addiction, it has to come at the expense of other important things. Which means, by definition, you can only be addicted to "progress" if you're progressing on the wrong things. This happens all the time, with plenty of people. And it's exactly why the fourth pillar of my life philosophy is to focus on problems that are meaningful to you.

I'm obsessed with meaning. I literally read books on the science of meaning (oxymoron?) in order to reverse engineer it for myself, and I think it's highly relevant to the questions of how we should work and what we should work on. So I'll share some of my learnings and experience in this area soon.

Here's the article from the guy who invented it
https://link.medium.com/NnNg4JlHPmb

Glad to hear it. Shoutout to @anthilemoon for writing about the technique.

At risk of sounding a bit too philosophical (even Machiavellian?), I try to think of ADHD or any other mental trait as neither good nor bad per se. Everything just boils down to understanding how things work and then reverse engineering them to suit your needs — ideally while not hurting other people in the process.

Exactly. I started improving the moment I realized it's a superpower instead of blaming myself with negative self-talk.

I have made it to where I am in my career/personal life with a mix of luck and intermittent hyper-focus, but have realized that I'm now in a situation where that really won't work much anymore.

That's my story too, and it's what forced me to get serious about finding advanced ways to cope and thrive.

do you have any other helpful advice for someone else new to being aware of this disorder and the ways you've managed it?

Yep. And based on the interest this article generated, I guess I have no choice but to dive a little deeper in upcoming posts. 👍

that highly scheduled routine looks truely horrible to me 🙂

Understandable!

Continuous personal improvement used to be a way of life for me but I found it overwhelming and I felt burnt out after a while.

For me this comes down to finding the right balance and giving myself permission to take one step at a time.

But it also comes down to culture. I probably put a lot more pressure on myself to improve because I surround myself with tech elites, haha. So yeah: there's a reason the fourth element of what I call the story model of purpose is to work on problems that specifically matter to you. Otherwise you can find yourself running other people's races.

Nice to see a founder active around here, seriously 😊

Ha! We're active around the clock with tech, management, and strategic work, but you're right: putting face time in the community itself has a lot of value as well.

One question, when you take your 60-minute breaks, do you do other work during that time, or are these 60-minute breaks computer/work free and just rest, like taking a nap, going for a walk, etc.?

One of the best questions in the comment section. I won't go into great depth here, but the short answer is that I simultaneously "allow" myself to do whatever I want (including working, playing video games, etc.), while firmly "nudging" myself in the direction of restful, low-dopamine activities [1]. Usually, this means my breaks consist of a combination of the following activities:

• meditation
• walking in nature
• taking a shower
• reading a book (usually in audiobook format)
• eating a snack
• taking a nap

[1] I made the connection that dopamine was really relevant here after reading the amazing book The Molecule of More, by Daniel Lieberman. I think it's required reading for every ambitious person. But yeah, I'll dive deeper into the science and experiential insights behind my work/break sessions in a different article.

after reading about it I decided to try it starting today. I wish I'd found it sooner, because I find it's a strategy for reflection and organisation that suits me much better than others I've tried. I don't know if it's related to being neurodivergent, but it just seems to work. My plan is to stick with it for 30 days, then decide whether to persist or pivot.

Really cool to hear that, thanks for sharing. Hope it works out!

You're miles ahead of me.

Thanks! But I should've mentioned this in the post: it's really not about this system being "better" or "worse," and it doesn't put me ahead or others behind. It really comes down to what works for every individual.

I know people doing incredible things who do it all by intuition and absolutely refuse to impose structure on the way they work.

It's an 8-week program. I'll do a write-up once it's over and I'm on par with you ;).

Dope! Looking forward to it.

you are not the only patient in the asylum! ;D

Well at least there are a few of us here. ;)

The way you talk about 'hierarchical units' made me think of how they are described in 'Thinking in Systems', a book I totally recommend for your read every day challenge ;)

Nice, it's already on a delivery truck en route to my place.

super happy to read that the implementation of 'my system' has been helping you. I look forward to keep improving it a little bit, every day :) Shoot me feedback anytime!

Yeah here's my feedback: you owe me royalties for all the word-of-mouth referrals I've sent your way!

Haha, just kidding. Good work on the app, and thanks.

I had a really , really bad experience with psych meds. I won't go off on that tangent too much as it's controversial and needs a lot of caveats, but I'm a little skeptical of some aspects of the psychiatric industry.

Sorry to hear that. I have a prescription to take meds every day, but I only take them twice a week. (Sometimes only once if I feel I'm really ahead on my work.)

I think we were both hardcore starcraft players, I also was semi-pro poker player for a while, so I'm really inspired by your thoughts on how to turn productivity into a game and look forward to your series.

Haha, that's actually @csallen who played StarCraft. But yeah, we're both gamers. These days I occasionally hop onto Fortnite during breaks:

Yep, that's right:

That's great. I've experimented a lot and I also find physically intense experiences to be effective ways to start the day. (Lately for me, cold showers have worked wonders.)

Awesome to hear you enjoyed the post!

Primarily notion, but there are a lot more. I'm finally working on some follow-up articles in this series where I'll go into more depth.

Damn, great questions. This will be fun.

How many years did it take you to reach this level of productivity?

Man. So, so long. I've been actively experimenting with productivity techniques for at least a decade (I found the book Willpower distinctly inspirational) and I've only hit a stride that I'm really proud of in the last 1–2 years.

Everyone needs hobbies and some relaxing time away from the screen to keep it up right?

100%.

What do you do for relaxing and for hobbies? Do you plan that in? How do you plan it?

The structure of my system takes care of the "relaxing" element: after each intensive 90-minute work session, I take a 60-minute break.

During these breaks, I indulge my hobbies:

• Reading
• Time with my girlfriend
• Chats/calls with friends
• Going for walks
• Gaming, occasionally

In fact, I call these 60-minute breaks my "restorative niches." The famous psychologist Brian R. Little coined the term [1] to refer to a place you go to be your "real self" and recharge after periods of self-discipline.

Out of every 10 weeks how many weeks do you score an 8-9/10 in productivity?

Well, these days I hit my target just about every week. But this is largely because I've become increasingly good at setting realistic targets.

(To humor you with your specific question, I'll answer "9 out of 10 weeks.")

Do you take (or used to take) any adhd meds like adderall? If not, what’s your caffeine consumption like?

Yes, I take Vyvanse about once a week. I originally took it daily, as prescribed, but over the years I've wittled the frequency down in proportion to the productivity gains I've made through external systems, improved habits, effective techniques.

Caffeine: 200mg per day. I don't want coffee staining my teeth so I just pop a caffeine pill in the morning before my workout, which everyone tells me is weird? But there you go.

Is there a purpose/meaning that moves you? Other than money/greatness/fame

Definitely. The only daily habit I haven't missed in two years is to review my personal mission.

I'm an atheist, so I've got a secular approach to meaning. Picture a pyramid with three sections: top, middle, and bottom.

• At the top of the pyramid is my character-based personal mission. The specific kind of person I want to become (or continually re-become). The kinds of principles and commitments I must embrace to remain in harmony with this ideal self. A brief snapshot of the duties incumbent on my ideal self in different roles: my private life, my professional life, and my social and family life.
• Below the top of the pyramid are my institutions: a list of core projects whose function is to actualize my otherwise-abstract personal mission. Things like "relationship management," "health and fitness," "public contribution," "philanthropy," "conscious recreation," and so on. These institutions are all infinite games; my aim is to continue playing them forever rather than to "complete" them.
• Finally, below each of these institutions I've got tons of one-off projects. This is the concrete stuff where real life happens: coding tasks, vacations, social meetups, blog posts, meditation, coaching friends through hard times, trying out new foods.

Do you ever get out of balance and go on long hours of pursuing ideas (like a late-nighter)? Or do you resist urges of creative-outburst to keep yourself in balance (wake up on time, exercise..etc)?

I get out of balance all the time. A few evenings ago I went down such a creative rabbit hole with a novel I'm working on I missed dinner and was late for a Zoom call.

One of the main things I like about my "90 minutes on / 60 minutes off" structure is that it keeps imperfections from turning into catastrophes. Say, for example, a planned 90-minute session runs on for two hours because I get distracted. No big deal: I just have to "pay" for this mistake by cutting the break a little short before moving on to my next 90-minute session.

Also, waking and sleeping on time are the daily habits I struggle the most with.

[1] For details on restorative niches and Brian Little's brilliant ideas on how to think about personal projects and their relationship to motivation and happiness, I highly recommend his book Who Are You, Really?

Makes sense. But realize that "superpower" here isn't being used as a description of objective reality; it's an act of cognitive reappraisal. In other words, it's a mental frame I'm using to cope with a particular challenge.

Everybody copes differently, but my general approach is to treat every problem in my life as an engineering problem that can be solved if properly diagnosed and studied. (Hence my references in the article to gamification.)

I'm surprised by the one hour breaks.

It would probably make more sense if you saw the intensity and focus with which I approach the 90-minute sessions. I typically don't even allow myself bathroom breaks.

I work like most people play video games. Ironically, this makes it fun and engaging to do work tasks that people typically dread or consider tedious.

Do you mean that you work 90 min, stop for 60, work for another 90 and so on?

Yes, though this is the simplified version. I figured it would be more useful to share this basic template than for me to share all of the granular details and exceptions I personally apply.

In reality, I actually have an initial session that doesn't stop at 90 minutes but actually stretches to 180 minutes or longer. It's my morning routine; it's roughly the same everyday.

What time do you start and stop working?

Up at 5:30am to begin the first session. As the day progress, I use a lot of interoception to monitor how I'm feeling and whether it's sensible to keep pushing on. Usually I'll aim to wrap up my final session no later than about 8pm, but it's really up in the air and depends on a lot of unforeseeable variables.

What do you do during breaks?

I "allow" myself to do anything I want, including continuing to work, playing video games, etc. But I firmly "nudge" myself to do activities that are restful, focused on the "here and now," and also constructive. Typically that means a combination of the following activities:

• reading a book (usually in audiobook format)
• meditation
• walking in nature
• taking a shower or bath
• eating a healthy snack
• taking a nap
• tidying up the apartment

How do you read?

The simple answer is that I read multiple books at a time — and usually in audiobook format. I limit myself to a max of eight at once, and only one of those can be fiction. If that sounds overwhelming to you, well, it did to me as well, at first. But then I tried it and it went smoothly.

Benefits of reading multiple books at once:

• At least with non-fiction, it's surprisingly easy to hold the information in short-term memory as you move from one book to the next. Most people realize that books are like school courses or blogs in this way. (If, in one day, you can jump from a science class to a math class to an english class, then take multiple exams at the end of the week, why can't you do something like this with books that you've specifically chosen because their topics personally interest you?)
• You literally never feel bad about abandoning a book and putting it permanently on the shelf if it loses your interest. Conversely, those who read one book at a time tend to make a huge deal out of soldiering through content they clearly aren't enjoying.
• When people give you compelling book recommendations, you rarely have to tell them, "Ah, yeah, that sounds great. I guess I'll throw that on my to-read list." Instead you say, "Ah, nice. I'll check it out tomorrow."

Some nuances on how I manage all this reading:

• I buy every format of the books I'm actively reading: audiobook, paperback (or hard cover), and e-book. This allows me to jump into any particular book in the most convenient way possible, depending on the context. I'm obsessed with removing friction, and this has served me really well. But also, I realize this is an expensive approach.
• All that being said, I mostly read books in audiobook format. And I rarely set time aside specifically for reading. (The exception is Sunday. Sundays are my "active reading" days.) Instead, I read while walking, while making and eating breakfast, while indoor biking, while working out, etc. And since I do all of these things everyday, the result is… a lot of reading.

Also, couple points on how I take book notes:

• By default, whenever I encounter a really interesting idea from a book I try to write it down immediately. I use Dynalist for this since it's fast and on all my devices.
• In addition to the books I'm reading, I also usually have an already-finished book that I'm studying for research purposes. These are almost always cognitive science books, story theory books, or business books — in line with my three main projects: improving my personal well-being, writing fiction, and running Indie Hackers.
• This is pretty meta, but I learned my process for researching books from a famous book called… How to Read a Book.

The narrative switch changes everything.

Crazy how that works, right? It seems so superficial but changing the way you look at things literally does change what you see.

So, question - how did you get diagnosed with ADHD? What was it about your habits and behaviours that made you think you may have ADHD?

Great questions. Getting diagnosed is simple (perhaps too simple?). You go to a doctor and explain your symptoms. If those symptoms align with textbook ADHD symptomology, you get diagnosed.

So the real question is part two: what symptoms made me think I had ADHD?

In a nutshell: at my baseline, I really struggle to focus on a given task unless it's highly compelling. And if something is highly compelling to me, I really struggle to break away from it and do something else (a phenomenon known as "hyperfocus"). There's other stuff as well, but this is what it all boils down to.

What's controversial about ADHD is that everyone has these symptoms to a degree, so it's reasonable to suspect that perhaps it's not a brain thing per se but rather a question of, say, the existence of more and less effective ways of coping.

Happily, modern neuroscience has started to pinpoint the neurophysiological mechanisms of the condition [1], and I suspect neural imaging techniques like fMRI will eventually become the standard of diagnosis in the future, provided costs come down.

Flexbox Defense looks awesome, will have a go later.

Merci!

[1] ADHD = low baseline levels of dopamine, which leads to an inability of the mind-wandering network in the brain (the "default mode network") to shut off when the task networks of the brain are turned on.

If you want to dive a little deeper into this (and hear from a credible Stanford neuroscientist instead of an admittedly non-credible tech nerd), check out this episode of the Huberman Lab podcast.

And if you want to dive wayyyy deeper into ADHD, check out Executive Functions by Russell Barkley, perhaps the world's leading authority on the condition.