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#224 - Deploying Empathy to Build Better Businesses with Michele Hansen of Geocod.io

Episode #224

My guest today is Michele Hansen (@mjwhansen) and she is here to challenge the stereotype that developers fear talking to customers and are naturally bad at it. We'll also get into specific principles and tactics from her recent book, "Deploy Empathy: A Practical Guide to Interviewing Customers."
• Read Deploy Empathy: https://deployempathy.com/
• Follow Michele on Twitter: https://twitter.com/mjwhansen
• Check out her podcast: https://softwaresocial.dev/

  1. 2

    If Chriss Voss (Never Split the Difference) and Rob Fitzpatrick (The Mom Test) wrote a book together it would be "Deploy Empathy".

    A great episode. Thank you for reminding us to think of not only the questions, but also how we ask them!

    1. 1

      That's a great way to put it! Both are super helpful, practical books.

  2. 2

    Hey Michele, not sure if my Q fits 100% DE topic but it is A-M-ANYTHING in the end )) Would be interesting to hear your thoughts on this "modern failure mode" described by Tyler in tweet per link. Which strategies and practices can help founder to not get into this trap? What is critical here during initial talks with prospects? Thanks! https://twitter.com/tylertringas/status/1402276242989240327

    1. 2

      great question! this problem is one that I thought about a lot as I wrote the book -- what if the only people who would ever buy the book were the ones following along with the newsletter and Software Social? I aired this fear at one point, and the person looked at me sort of quizzically and said "You're afraid that the people who support you and want to see you succeed want to help you succeed?"

      With that said, I think Tyler's talking about a very specific, small group of founders here. There are some "brand-name" founders who have such a large audience that anything they make is guaranteed to have some customers due to sheer volume and strength of personality. I read it as a critique of conventional VC fundraising that emphasizes whether someone has prior exits and etc, which doesn't factor in as much to the Calm/TinySeed/etc model. I don't read his tweet as applying to everyday founders like us :)