It sucks that the easiest way to get to 15k MRR is to just get a job

As someone that's lived off my SaaS's revenue for over a decade, quite often I wish I just had a nice 9-5 job. My time isn't really my own, it's just worth a lot less to a lot more people. Sometimes it's great and I'm thankful, other times it's the worst. Just like everything, it's a compromise.

As some others have said, don't wait for a great idea. Entering a crowded market with a boring idea means the demand exists. All you have to do is be a little more appealing than a couple competitors, and the sales are right there for the taking.

Keep your 9-5 and use it as a safety set. It'll allow you to take risks with your side projects you otherwise couldn't afford. Pick something with an incredibly narrow scope, and just do it. It may be a terrible idea, but you'll get more out of that than sitting on your hands wishing you had a good idea.

I'm 30, and 3 years ago I left my banking career to do full-time e-commerce as a bootstrapped startup. Best decision of my life. But let me tell you somethings:

1. This whole entrepreneurship lifestyle dream is completely over-romanticised. It's extremely hard, extremely stressful, and simply not made for everyone. As happy as I am with my business, I'm 100% certain that there are million of 9-to-5 people that are much much happier than I am. So don't dwell too much if you never end up doing a startup - you seem to have a great career, seem to have a great family - enjoy it.

2. If you DO want to start a business, you need to stop overthinking it, stop trying to think of the "perfect" idea - it doesn't work and it doesn't matter!

Let me explain. I worked at the world's largest private wealth manager - our bank served more billionaires than any other bank in the world. Less than 0.1% of our clients invented something incredible with their "perfect" idea and got rich. 99.9% of the millionaires just did regular plain, businesses, and did it well. They were in the laundry business, logistics business, kettle business, door business, consulting business, etc, etc, etc.

You don't need to have a "big" idea to start. Just start. Better to have a finished half-decent idea than an unfinished amazing idea. So take any decent idea from your 10-year old never-ending list of ideas and just go with it. If you're good enough to make your magical "best" idea work, then you're good enough to make your "second-best" idea work or your "fifth-best" idea work.

"Analysis paralysis" is real and it's dragging you down. Just get started, work on it on the side in addition to your day-job, and leave your corporate life behind only when you're financially & mentally ready for 100% commitment. Maybe until then you'll see that this entrepreneurship journey isn't as glorious as it seemed in the first place.

It's a cliche but also true that on your way to $15k you must first reach $15. Making $15 from something you built is actually super fun and rewarding if you have fun doing it.

Take your best 5 ideas*, trim them right back to one single feature (or something downloadable), put it on the internet with a buy/subscribe button, tell a bunch of people who might be interested, and see if you can get to $15. When the first five things don't work (they won't so you must have fun building them) look at what got the most traffic, any feedback you got, and what you learned. Then try the next 5 armed with the knowledge from the first 5. Just spend an hour or two per day on this to keep it low risk.

It will take you years to get to $XXk but while you're on your way there you will get to $10 per month (a coffee and a beer) and $100 per month (some groceries and Netflix) and $500 per month (your life partner says "well done honey") and $1,000 per month (let's go on holiday!). See you at $15k!

• Good bootstrapped ideas venn diagram: 1. You see people paying for this thing already or something very close to it 2. You can think of a single-feature under-engineered version. 3. You have the skills and domain specific knowledge to implement it in under three months (ideally you've implemented something similar before). 4. The concept gets you excited enough for long enough to see it through.

I’m the same way and realized that a few months ago that maybe i don’t want a saas. what i want is a low maintenance way for me to live however i want. a saas or software product that requires customer support is not what i day dream about. i’ve since shifted focus to find small to medium bets that i just ad adsense or affiliate links to. the goal is something like sudoku.com or camelcamelcamel. just generate a ton of web traffic for a basic need and convert to money with a ton of automation and then on to the next project.

I've a family as well and in my mid-40's; I understand the hesitation. I came upon the same feelings as you while working at Chase, not enthusiastic, not inspired, and quite bored. I decided to leave that job and start my own freelancing business that eventually turned into a design studio, which is what I do today. I used my skillset, what I do best, and a bit of savings and took a leap.

I would have rather taken the risk, with my wife's support, then to have withered away working for someone else. I cannot say that it's easy starting a business while supporting a family, and there're plenty of stressful moments, but for me it is worth it. I get to feel that I'm my own master and I'm responsible for how my life turns, not someone else.

Good luck in your possible endeavors, or staying where you are. Just try to be happy wherever you are. Life is beautiful either way, it's just you're the one that has to find it beautiful.

Being comfortable and earning a good income is still a blessing that many never even get to experience. However, as you mentioned yourself, you trade your time for an even amount of money, meaning that you're not getting everything from your potential. I would say, in your free time, think about what you're currently doing at work/day to day as a developer and try to spot if there's any tasks/problems that occur to you. List them in a notebook and after a while, you'll have an idea right in-front of you, an idea that you are well aware of. Good luck!

I like this article; it captures how I felt working for people. In my twenties, I had a junior, yet lucrative, position in an investment bank, and I hated it! I had no autonomy or control over my time and had to sit at a trading station for 12 hours a day - often pretending to be busy.

I escaped banking and set up a financial lead-generation start-up with a colleague. This was a me-too business, not this one big idea. We scaled it to around $50,000 a month, and at the time I had never felt happier; however, 18 months in regulations changed and we could not use our tried and tested marketing funnels - income fell to $6k, and my business partnership fell apart.

Long story short, I had to get another job. However, I found a career I love - a Computer Science Professor. I am earning less than I could in a professional, industry role, but I still have autonomy and freedom; however, I no longer have the risk.

In summary it was the type of job I had, not that I actually disliked being employed. Do I still dream of having a start-up? Yes! However, I can now tinker and build up a side hustle without the risk.

As someone in mid 20's I feel stuck and trying but no break through. Then I will stuck in analysis paralysis, trying to come out with some big idea. After a while I realize I am to stupid to know what is the "big idea" and the only hope is spray and pray.

So I try my best to move fast and quickly spamming as much idea as I can.

If I be honest, my biggest fear is being on your situation, because now you will need to accept it and if you don't even have basic skill to do it , it become even more hard.

But there is huge number of people succeeded after having all the responsibility. Not sure how but I assume they took massive risk on that.

Anyway I wish you luck and let me know if you are building anything I can help promote or if you want me helping you out with something just let me know.

Good luck man, keep me updated

Here is my reading on analysis paralysis and how to overcome it : https://medium.com/@muhdazharali98/avoid-analysis-paralysis-at-all-co-565f68ccfb21

Hey Tom, totally get where you're coming from. It's a common sentiment amongst many people who feel the urge to start their own thing but are stuck in the 'comfortable trap'. Here are some insights that might help:

Start Small: The 'big idea' you're waiting for doesn't have to be a grand, disruptive vision. It can be a simple solution to a problem you face in your daily work. Look around, keep your eyes open for opportunities.

Side Hustle: Instead of quitting your job outright, start working on your idea during your free time. This allows you to test and iterate on your concept without the financial risk. There are numerous stories of successful entrepreneurs who built their startups while still holding full-time jobs.

Collaborate: You don’t have to do it all by yourself. Find like-minded people, perhaps on this very platform, who share your aspiration. Teaming up can divide the workload and multiply the inspiration.

Leverage Your Position: Use your current status as a software engineer to your advantage. Whether it's industry connections, technical skills, or insight into certain problems - all of these are assets.

Remember, there's no 'right time' to start. The best time is now. Best of luck!

I totally hear you.

I also have a mortgage and let me tell you: kids are another leap that make this significantly harder. If you're planning on having kids, I'd recommend trying to build something now before you have kids so that you can focus on it full time by the time they're born.

I have two kids under five. It's interesting to listen to Startups for the Rest of Us and hear the stories of many other bootstrapped founders who were successful even with young kids: they talk about travel, how exhilarating it was to work long hours because the business was their own, etc.

In the back of my mind, I can't help but wonder "... but when?". My wife has a career of her own and we're equal partners with respect to raising our kids and household responsibilities. By the time our kids are down at night, it's 8:30pm and I have maybe an hour and a half of "working time" at a time of day when I can't realistically do customer interviews or anything like that.

I'm convinced that most bootstrapped founders with kids either:

1. Uses a significant amount of time at their day job to grow their own business or
2. Have a relationship where their spouse takes on a disproportionate amount of responsibility for the children until the business gets off the ground

I'm really unsure how to navigate that.

Making the leap from full-time work to part-time, gradually transitioning into full-time indiehacking as revenue grows. Excited about the journey ahead!

For most people, 9-5 jobs are best. They experience less stress in their lives. And they are happier.

But after a certain point it gets monotonous. It's starting to get boring. Or you are estranged from your co-workers.

If you have an idea in mind, it might be nice to let it go. But if you say you'll buy it later, I say don't get involved.

To give an example from myself, an idea came to my mind almost every day in my 20s. I still have over 10 ideas lined up. But the idea alone is not enough. When you start, you run into problems bigger than the idea.

The most important of these is the difficulty of working alone. Lack of motivation is your worst enemy. No matter how brilliant your idea, how knowledgeable you are, if your motivation is lost, you will die.

No matter how much sales revenue, no matter how motivated you are, it is not enough to gain motivation.

Stay motivated.

I feel the same way. I go to work step by step in a big company, worrying about losing my job one day. So start working as an independent hacker now, and let side hustle share some of the risk.

1. First, recognize that this feeling of wanting to get to the "next level", will probably always be consistent. If you think about this 2 hours a day now at a level 3, you will always think about it for 2 hours a day at a level 3 unless you actively work on that.

For instance, if you were making $15k MRR with your own business, you would be wishing it was $30k MRR.

1a. Comparison is the thief of joy and there is only 1 person on this earth that is the richest person they know.

2. I've tried a number of times and a number of methods to start my own businesses. Currently I have a very good job. I look at that as an asset, not a liability. So I'm building a side project that can exist and grow with my job. I think of it like a test/validation. I look at longevity as an advantage (I don't have to fund it or drive revenue immediately to survive). This limits the type of projects I can choose, but that's fine. For instance, because I have a day job the business I choose cannot require a sales motion. It has to be self service.

3. You will have to sacrifice something for the chance to start this business and level up. It's really easy to look back 5 years ago and wish you sacrificed in the past for your present. But that didn't happen. So what does it look sacrifice look like now? Probably working nights and weekends to build something that might work... and skipping that next vacation. Probably focusing on grit, not self care. Probably being more organized and disciplined like we all wish we could be.

Take the new wisdom you have from looking back, feeling trapped, get motivated and start building something! Good luck and let me know how I can help.

I'm in my mid-thirties, have a family, mortgage and job. And I've always known, too, that I was not meant to be an employee ;)

I've followed the philosophy of Rob Walling's stairstepping approach for a few years.

That is, I launched an app as a small side-hustle and will grow it slowly, until I can use the revenue to buy out my own time. Currently, around 50% of my income comes from my side hustle.

I still need the day job to cover all our expenses but the side hustle enables me to buy out some of my time. Fortunately, I also have a very understanding boss. So I use my side hustle revenue to take a yearly sabbatical (2-3 months) and reduce work hours, so I only work 4 days a week. I then invest the off-time in supporting and improving my app.

If my day job was not as understanding, I would consider switching to freelancing.

Hi! I advise you to look through some posts and podcasts here, on Indie Hackers. Lots of people shared their story where they successfully transitioned from a job to indie hacking. For example read about stories at the starting page section "Set Aside Time & Money" or search for posts or just listen to podcasts .

I made a post about all methods I could find that can help you overcome your "big idea" problem: Avoid the Grave with These Starting Methods.

I completely agree. I'm relatively young, at 20, and it has been much easier for me to earn money working for someone else than on my own.

It's quite frustrating because I prefer managing my own projects and building them from scratch.

But as you said, I still have time to make it possible since I have no real anchors tying me down to continue working for others.
I hope I'll find a way to change this ASAP!

Good luck to you. I hear persistence is the key. ;)

I can totally empathise with your situation, it’s way harder for someone in your position to drop everything and begin founding. It seems like this is what you live and breathe though so you’ve got to make it happen. How? I’m not sure, I’m just some kid in his twenties working on his first side project.

Be careful of falling into the trap of consuming content that makes you feel productive (books, podcasts etc) by amping you up and then you end up never executing on it.

As for the idea, “the big one” I’m unsure how much that matters if you’re just starting out? Currently what I’m building isn’t unique but it’ll prove to myself that I can launch something and maybe I’ll make my first internet dollar (that’s a drug I want hooked on).

1 is better than 0, a little everyday will compound into something. Good luck - Calvin

waiting for the "big idea" is a fail. As you stated, you already have a lot of thoughts about dealing with hiring etc. This will not be as planned when you finally start.
It is all about executing the idea not having the best idea ever!
So why you don´t take an already existing idea (for what there is already validation out there) and start to bootstrap as a side hustle?? No risk, just a huge amount of learnings.

Note: I love giving advice that I don't follow myself :D

Don't forget your advantages, limited time should prevent procrastinating, having an income increases the options you can pursue, and dependents your motivation.

One trick I use when I have a long term goal that feels daunting: imagine what advice you'd give someone else who wanted to accomplish that goal, commit to following that advice for some manageable duration each day, then put an "exit ramp" date on your calendar where you can assess whether you want to recommit to that goal.

I call this the "ACE technique" (advice, commit, exit ramp) and I've found that by giving myself an exit ramp, it becomes easier to take the first steps.

Specifically, it helps me get past the first stage where I can viscerally imagine the sacrifices that come with starting something hard (No TV! Tired all the time!), but the long-term benefits seem distant. It takes a while for those long-term benefits to manifest and this can help carry you through.

If you're interested in more details, I wrote a short explanatory blog post here.

I can completely relate to your situation, as I am also navigating both being an "employee" and an indie founder. Don't be too harsh on yourself for feeling "comfortable." Balancing work, family, and pursuing your entrepreneurial dreams is a challenging journey. The skills and experiences you've gained as a software engineer will undoubtedly prove valuable in your pursuit. Remember, progress, no matter how small, is significant. Take your time and steady steps toward your goals while ensuring the well-being of your family. Your dedication and perseverance will lead you to success in due time. Keep going, and know that you're not alone on this path!

I absolutely relate! I've always dreamt of getting my own life-style commercial enterprise too, but existence's duties and my profession as a software program engineer have stored me tied to being an employee. It feels like the barrier to pursue our goals has gotten higher with time. I wonder if there are any Indie Hackers who have controlled to break free from this consolation quarter. If you have got any inspiring stories, please share! I know it might sound like privileged whining, however I consider there are others right here who can understand. Let's join and guide every different in this adventure.

This post definitely resonates with me. I had a bunch of "side hustles" as a teenager (putting up Christmas lights, watching people's pets while they were on vacation, mowing lawns), but the golden handcuffs of a well paying job and the increased responsibility that comes with a family, a mortgage, etc. definitely kept me "employed" over the last few years.

Like others have said, you don't necessarily need to wait for a "big idea". I'm finding that doing the same thing others are doing but doing it better (or just slightly different) may be enough. Good luck moving forward, excited to see what you come up with!

I am in my twenties and actively doing this, it's hitting hard. I'm 25, got my first software job at 19 so I've been going at it hard for 6 years.

In the meantime, I've rarely done anything "startup-y" except for the past 2 years.

Despite having a family, a wife, and a steady job. I'm determined to get more out of life. But yes, it does feel like a trap most times, and I contemplate just quitting every single day.

This quote right here pretty much sums it up for me.

"I’ve always known I wasn’t meant to be an employee."

It also sucks that with a "job" you get diminishing returns for how hard and smart you work and that you're generally rewarded for the time you put in (even if you aren't doing anything), and less for being effective and efficient.

we're not here for $15k MRR, we're here for $1.5M MRR

jobs are for normies

be better

I'm in a situation quite like yours, but with one difference: I'm not an employee but a freelancer. However, much like you, I'm not the master of my time. I continue to search for that game-changing idea to launch a business, even though I have a couple of concepts that might be viable. They're just not the 'BIG IDEA' I'm seeking, and this persistent feeling of being an impostor always holds me back. As a highly experienced software developer, what terrifies me is not knowing how to tackle all the non-technical tasks required to become an entrepreneur.

When the big idea comes, put your heart and soul into it. Don't forget to market the crap our of it.

yeah another part of it is marketing is such an essential piece of business anymore. It doesn't matter what you're building if nobody sees it it's like it never existed. With so many people marketing and posting content nowadays its SOOO HARD to stand out. marketing is really the heartbeat of your business anymore... you could even have totally shit software but if your marketing is stellar you'll win.

Hey Tom, I'm thrilled by the supportive comments and recommendations. Let's talk entrepreneurship and risk—the moment you decide to start your own business, risk follows. Embracing bigger risks yields greater rewards. I don't mean quitting your job blindly; multiple plans in place are crucial. The big idea may strike unexpectedly, just like it happened to me.

Last year, I paused my marketing career and moved to Montenegro with my girlfriend, seeking a remote job with good MRR. I gave myself a year to achieve something. It wasn't always easy, with struggles and thoughts of giving up, but I kept pushing until JudgeUs app's idea unexpectedly dawned on me. Now, it's published on the App Store, and I genuinely love what I do. Embracing risks without regret is the key.

Challenge yourself, embrace discomfort, and solutions will follow.

I completely understand your feelings. I used to be an engineer until I quit my job to venture into the startup world.

The moment of truth for me was when I came up with the concept for AI2sql. The inception of AI2sql came not from a "big idea", but a simple tool designed to resolve a specific issue: transforming natural language into SQL queries. This was born from common frustrations faced by many engineers, particularly around difficulties encountered in SQL query. Today, it stands as a tool designed to facilitate ease and efficiency in SQL query construction, marking an important milestone in the journey of entrepreneurship.

Before I found success with AI2sql, I had tried and tested several other products. It was a journey of trial and error but when AI2sql reached $4K MRR, I knew it was worth it. It's all about persistence, starting small, and relentlessly pursuing your dream.

A small note, but hindsight is 20/20. Were it the case you'd pursued a number of business ideas - successful or not - you may find you were instead posting on another forum, as many in that lifestyle are, about how you're wondering if you made the right decision prioritizing your goals over starting a family, stability, security etc.

That is to say, I think it's great you're in touch with what drives you, don't lose sight of that. It's an intuition that can be a good warning sign of burnout / depression in your lifestyle, and maybe an indication it's time for change (which could be a new job, or starting that business venture).

I like to do indie hacking on the side of my job.
I automated a lot of stuff so I do some things much faster which leaves time for indie hacking.

Have you looked into prop firm trading or trading the markets using algo trading bots?

Prop firm trading is when you use an institutions money to trade with (ie $100k) and only pay for the evaluation fee to secure a funded account. Currently popular for Futures and Forex (no not the scammy MLMs you might be thinking).

You can basically use (or code) these algo bots on your prop firm accounts and shoot for securing, let’s say, a safe 5-10% a month return. Then you can buy more prop firm accounts and let the math add up.

Not an affiliate by any means, just someone who’s tapping into this to fund my lifestyle and work on my side gigs as well.

Tom I have been there. You might be similar to me. The answer to your question is doing side hustle. I started building software agency on side and when the agency business was able to pay me my salary ( not the same that I was making as a dev ), I left my job.
I am still not there. We are still building products on side ( which is incredibly hard) but we will reach there soon - keep pushing.

Yeah, its hard to accept that sometimes the safe option is the best option currently.

Have you considered investing like a retirement account or something?
Just in case you're never able to pursue the dream

Remember we work to take care of those we love... If being comfortable is what it takes. Then maybe, that's all that matters.

Just like you, I may never get to build my own product and I am okay with that

I don't have all the answers. My mindset might be wrong though.

I feel like you—I don't want to be an employee. I want to build a company, but no matter how hard I try to improve my skills, it seems like I am not cut out for this, especially when it comes to sales. Right now, while trying to figure out what to do, I feel like I am losing my life. Currently, I don't have much money, being a developer. This situation is really tough for me

Welcome to the world of "Median Group", we are all stuck right at the middle. Good enough at lot of things but not great at anything, desperate enough to leave what we are currently doing but not passionate enough to risk all for something new.. and i dont believe there is a right answer but like most ppl are saying the probable answer is to look for multiple small ideas leading to small win compare to Big Idea. just like work out let your founder muscle grow with increasing intensity till its strong enough. All of this is only theory for me as well since i havent launched anything myself but at least thats how i am approaching it

You're not alone in your feelings! Many of us dream of creating our own ventures but find timing or the "big idea" elusive.

Your experiences as a software engineer are invaluable assets, and often the perfect idea emerges from a blend of our skills and passions (that's where I'd look). It's not always about waiting for the perfect moment; sometimes it's about seizing the moment and making it perfect. Keep the passion alive, and know this community backs you. Your dreams are valid!

Best,
Alt 🚀

Completely agree.. I am in the same boat. It feels more and more risky to take the leap as time goes by - much more to lose now than years ago.

Having said that, I am trying to enjoy the founders mental state. Agreed, I can't quit as soon as the first few sales happen but i can still enjoy the journey. The side hustle will take longer to become the main job though.

I think Codie Sanchez summed it up best. She said you have to be willing to sacrafice comfort for freedom. It's the biggest trade for entrepreneurship. I always have to remind myself that nothing is ever truly secure. Whether it's a w2 job or a business. Everything has it's risks. What risks are you willing to take on?

I understand you but the fastest way to start your own thing right now, Is to be a Technical co-founder of a promising startup.

Either you start gradually and get a cofounder or key into a dream that resonates with you.

Get someone passionate who can move the needle forward while you do Tech stuff and gradually transition

Hey Tom,

I am yet a student and I always got inspired from indie hacking stories. I even started my own company with a couple of friends, hoping we would make great games. No I have an internship in a mid-sized game dev company and see many people on the daily like me - people that were once motivated to have companies of their own, but chose rather the secure paycheck.

Don't get me wrong, it's one of the best companies in my country, maybe even the best. But there is still this spirit inside of me to do something big that I can call my own (not games for sure, lol). At least while I am still young and able to take risk, but I get your point - everyone sharing their big MMR numbers is... scary? uncomfortable? making you doubt your skills?

I have taken a massive pay cut this year (75%) since I needed a job for non-financial reasons, to continue on my side project.

I feel like this too, I am giving it time.

Pickleball could be the "big idea" you've been searching for! This fast-growing sport offers a unique opportunity to create a lifestyle business around it. As an Indie Hacker, you can blend your passion for pickleball with your software engineering skills to build a thriving startup. Don't let comfort hold you back—take the leap! Many have overcome similar barriers and found success. Embrace the challenge, follow your passion, and join the community of like-minded Indie Hackers on this exciting journey. You've got this!
landofpickleball🏓🚀