We need to talk about indie life & the "successful" makers we follow (re: Dagobert's update)

Since reading Dagobert's post this week - Shutting down our startup after 5 years (please read it if you haven't already), a bunch of stuff has been on my mind. I'll try to make it as coherent as possible.

Like me, many of you will have followed Dagobert's journey, read his tweets, been entertained by his memes, and hear him talking about his journey on the IndieBites podcast.

First off, it made me feel sad to hear about what he's been going through - and see him talking about it on IndieBites recently. It sounds like he's at the beginning of a journey of unwinding, coming back to centre and figuring out a new, healthy way forward. I wish you the very best, Dagobert.

It also spoke to me as, after more than 3 years of trying to make my creator business work, I've recently come to the realisation the hours of work for little reward have left me feeling burned out and in a place where I need to do something else. I've has the opportunity to travel in that time, and had some really rich and rewarding experiences, but it's also come with its downsides (deep and meaningful friendships, dating... I've struggled with whilst I've been working all the time - both at home and on my travels, enjoying the so-called "digital nomad" lifestyle. My thoughts on that whole topic for another post, perhaps...).

Anyhow, here goes...

SUCCESS
What is/isn't success? From everything I'd been seeing I'd seen Logology as a success and Dagobert as an indie success story. The income updates, the twitter following, the appearances in pieces and podcasts... I think we have to be really careful about assuming what is outwardly successful and doing well.

I'm so glad Dagobert's made a choice to make a change after struggling for so long - and also for having the courage to share how much he's been struggling behind the scenes. <3

THE INDIE LIFE
For a long time I've looked up to and been a little envious of the likes of Pieter Levels, Dan Vasallo, Kevon Cheung, Dan Rowden, Arvid Kahl, etc.

All makers who have thrived when it's come to twitter growth and (from what I can tell) enjoyed making some income along the way.

Good luck to them. If they've found a way to be profitable and happy in their lives, then great.

(I've been plugged a little into the IndieLondon scene, and seen others who have also struggled with their mental health as they've sought to make the indie thing "work").

I think everyone has to realise that the "indie life" is definitely not all roses. I think anyone who's been plugging away for a year or more will know that.

I think the best part of it is the community and the people you meet. The connections made. I know Dagobert has expressed similar and appears to be much-loved on the internet (rightly so).

But as for that elusive "end goal" of profitability and maintaining a healthy work-life balance that involves hobbies, friendships, and the rest... this is much, much harder.

THE TWITTER "BUBBLE"
Controversial opinion here, and no offence to anyone intended.

But somewhere along the line (pretty early on, actually) "building in public" got really f*cking annoying.

It's the same old regurgitated stuff, encouraging people to build a twitter following without any promise of income/profit... it's easy assume that big following = $$ and success.

I think a part of it is that Twitter has changed recently (since the ownership change), hence lots of these makers who've relied on it for visibility have complained and started to double-down elsewhere. (I've seen Daniel Vasallo, Dan Rowden & others have tweeted about this, and indicated they're pivoting to other platforms/side projects in recent months).

I can't help but feel that there is this endless focus on posting consistent tweets that "add value"; I enjoy seeing someone's growth journey, warts-n-all, and this is why I'll ALWAYS enjoy reading a blog more than a twitter feed.

Because twitter has become more and more about bigging yourself up, celebrating so-called "wins", posting nice pictures of you working from different places, and commenting/sharing for the sake of your own growth.

It's like a race to twitter growth, through banal/meaningless tweets to... get a following and look cool? There's an argument to say that if you have a product you're selling to Indies, twitter growth has some value.

But I've just seen it become a borefest of the same meaningless sh*t and the same few people at the "top" (again, no offence intended) preaching to the rest the same old stuff about how to be a successful "maker".

Ironically, because of twitter's algorithm changes and saturation point, even the "twitter growth" courses out there and becoming less effective. And, at best, even if growth does work, there's absolutely no guarantee you'll make any money.

Is it time to start doing business offline again, through good old 1:1 sales? Who am I to know, I've not built a profitable company yet.

Sidenote: I'm not saying they're all dodgy, but all these 'grow on twitter' courses... twitter growth's sake for twitter growth's sake? Is there really any point in growing a twitter following? Like, why?

Ponzi-scheme, anyone? 🤔 ("Let's make money selling a course on how to grow on twitter even though, for the average person, it'll be of little-no help whatsoever..."). Just throwing that out there.

INDIE MAKERS
Everyone knows the "big names" out there. I've mentioned a few already. They've got big followings and share their income reports and the rest.

Dagobert was super honest throughout his post and shared that:

"Sure we had some wins, and I'm proud that we brought it to ~$3k revenue per month (+ $5k from my twitter course). But with the cost of living + running a business in France, it's barely enough to survive."

And also:

"I also feel silly for celebrating that we reached profitability a few months ago... then a couple of months later it was already back below survival level 🤦‍♂️"

To be clear, I don't think it was Dagobert's intention to mislead anyone whatsoever in sharing the successes of Logology.

But it's made me think about the other "indie makers" out there with big followings (except, Pieter Levels, that guy's pretty set for life - and doesn't particularly have to worry about marketing himself, or [give(https://www.reddit.com/r/digitalnomad/comments/13l2w5a/pieter_levels_make_is_it_a_scam_or_is_there_more/) much of a sh*t these days...

How "well" are they really doing?

How is their wellbeing?

What is their life really like behind their inflated twitter followings?

Do you really want to be cooped up indoors half-naked all day on your laptop building products and replying to tweets? (Not healthy, and terrible posture).

MENTAL HEALTH
As I've mentioned previously, I've been aware - in indie circles - that there is often a story behind why someone is so eager to pursue the indie life.

For me (and I know others too), the freedom aspect was big.

But I think, for many of us if we are being honest, we are trying to get some sort of validation/approval/worth from "succeeding" as Indies.

And before we know it we are working every hour under the sun (and after), 7 days a week, isolating ourselves and fixating to achieve "indie success" AT ALL COSTS.

(It reminds me of when I used to go to the gym to just get bigger, bigger, bigger... I eventually realised that's not what I or my body wanted)

Surely, something has to give?

//

That's about it. Rant over.

I think I wanted to articulate some of my thoughts after Dagobert's announcement earlier, and my own recent experiences with pursuing the indie life.

Maybe, just maybe, having a job that pays the bills isn't actually so bad after all. It's important to put everything into perspective. Something you enjoy enough, that offers enough of what you're looking for (type of role, company, people you're working with, work flexibility...), that doesn't come at such an enormous cost - stress, pressure, over-working, and letting your hobby and relationships fall behind the wayside.

Why are you pursuing the indie path?

What are you looking for really?

Why is it we care so much about identity/status as indies and "making it"? Is there something deeper missing from our lives?

Don't blindly follow the hype. There aren't enough real experiences shared, like what Dagobert has shared.

PS. Respect to IndieLdn & RamenClub and other communities that allow you to video or - better yet - hang out with other indies IN-PERSON. If you're not doing the already, get out there and meet real people and have real conversations. It'll bring you more in touch with the realities. You'll meet actual people, many of whom (almost all) are still in regular jobs and making products on the side. It'll get you out of the bubble a little bit.

Edit: I'd be curious to know the % of indies who successfully reach profitability. It's not impossible, but I think it's much lower than it appears. Though, of course, not everyone is visible online.

And, guess what... There are plenty of makes who aren't "building in public" or sharing what they're up to on social media. One last thing... with AI on the way, growth gurus and all this other bullsh*t is only going to be ramped up online (cue automated tweets on steroids). I'm spending less and less time on social platforms, and more on blog platforms and forums (or with people/irl community). Away from the increasingly false reality that is "online".

//

Thank for reading, and apologies for this being a bit all over the place. I'd love to read any comments, to hear other perspectives, and to read more stories of the struggles. I think they're lurking out there, beneath the faux-glitz of the hype tweets and posts.

More than anything, don't let working on your business take over your life completely. Make time for connection, being outside, hobbies, just vegging out over a film or meal. It's okay. The indie life isn't everything. You're amazing - and worthy - exactly as you are.

PS. It's important to re-iterate that, in this piece, I've not intended to criticise any particular indie, product or course out there. Just call out some of the BS and unhealthy/false narratives about indie life that exist out there.

Peace & love. ✌💛